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Evidence for Necrons in new Ork footage
Doobeedoo
I made this image comparing Necron design elements (mostly GW minis, 1 piece of homemade terrain, and also some DOW1 screens) with the design elements of the new tileset/map we saw in the latest Ork gameplay footage from IGN.
You can see things match up quite closely. Now keep in mind this Ork mission takes place in the "Outer Vaults" (sounds like a place where Necrons would like to hang out). What lurks in the "Inner Vaults" which the Orks are heading to at the end of the mission?
If Necrons have not yet been revealed to the player at this point in the campaign, it would make sense that there are no overt symbols like Necron head statues etc, just more subtle design cues.
There's also a lot of other evidence for Necrons in the game.
- Both previous DoW games have had a secret "big bad" enemy towards the end of the campaign in addition to the standard SM, Orks and Eldar. It was Chaos in DOW1 and Tyranids in DOW2. Orks don't really have the "big bad evil" vibe, and Dark Eldar are more a nuisance than a major threat. That leaves Necrons.
- Before DOW2 came out, Relic kept Tyranids secret until after SM, Orks and Eldar had been revealed. They even cut them out of the cinematic trailer, only showing the full trailer later.
- The story of DOW3 reads "supremacy must be suspended for survival" meaning races must temporarily put aside hostilities in order to survive some greater threat.
- The story of DOW3 has similarities to the story of Winter Assault: The races all go to an icy planet searching for a powerful weapon (a Titan vs the Spear of Khaine), only to find a greater threat (in Winter Assault it's non-playable Necrons).
- Just before DOW3 was announced, Relic added the Necron Lord to DOW2 Last Stand, a game which had not received any new content in years.
However on the other hand, Relic has been firm about there being only 3 playable races at launch. If they had a 4th race, why wouldn't they want to advertise that as a selling point? So if Necrons are present, perhaps they are campaign enemies only and not playable at launch (ala Winter Assault).
Comments
Doobeedoo
Edit: Full size image: http://i.imgur.com/Iludt82.jpg
Oh also, the opening quote from the DOW3 cinematic announcement trailer:
"There is a terrible darkness descending upon the galaxy, and I do not think we shall see it ended in our lifetimes."
This is taken from the Necron Codex and is an Inquisitor talking about the Necrons.
PhilthyPhilPhD
This looks pretty convincing in my opinion, it seems almost for sure that they are the big bad in the campaign. I hope they introduce them as a playable race at or shortly after launch (not sure which I would prefer). It's interesting that in the past they say which mission it is in the campaign but in this one they have not said, maybe that's forthcoming. If they want the big bad to be a surprise for the campaign and not spoil it I expect they will not announce or release Necrons for a while though. I can't see how anyone could deny that they are the secret threat though.
GenDrameron
N1
good sight.
Cankat
I was just going to make a thread about this too. There are too many parallels between this map's architecture/motifs and necrons'. Thanks for pointing some of them out.
WarbossGogangash
You just spoiled the whole storyline.
Doobeedoo
I mean, in my defence, pretty much all Relic's 40k storylines go like this:
"The Imperium (typically Space Marines) were fighting xenos and then SURPRISE big baddies turn up (if the Eldar are here, they probably tried to warn about it but got killed for being arrogant meddlers instead). Eventually the big bad is defeated resulting in a phyrric victory for everyone, the end."
DOW1, Winter Assault, DOW2, Chaos Rising and Space Marine all follow this pattern.
GuruSkippy
And you forgot : "Orks are here, manipulated by eldars or chaos"
NeroVipusQc
Nice job !
WarbossGogangash
I still thought tho that they'll set up a more complex story, mostly because they said a lot that they'll go hard on the singleplayer campaign. But as we know relic they won't make anything more complex than that, even now that they ++heresy redacted++ up things that they were the masters at before.
Silk
There's a chance another race is in the game indeed but I wouldn't count on a playable race.
Well, most planets in the Imperium have names related to death, agony and brutality. Armageddon, Krieg, Barbarus, Necromunda, Mordian, Murder, Eldritch, etc.
Creature
At this point I'd actually be surprised if Necrons are not available to play at release. I'm anticipating that not so long after the Ork faction reveal, we'll get another "surprise" faction reveal. Followed shortly after this hype building announcement they'll open up for preorders and give a release date.
If they aren't available for release, I'd expect them being offered to people preordering and buying in the first week or two, to be delivered when ready. Similar to what Battlefleet Gothic Armada did with SM and Tau.
At least, that's what I'd do, especially with the middling reception the game has gotten so far. Announcing Necrons as fourth race would help invigorate sales, imo. I'd think it'd be worth delaying the game a little bit, if necessary, to get that push the hype train needs. I'm on it, but more would join with Necrons...
Renner
Even though Necrons may appear in the campaign in some capacity, that still doesn't mean they'll be playable day 1. Imperial Guard units appeared in DoW2 and CR, and they have become a playable faction yet in Retribution. And that also doesn't mean we may wait for them in some big expansion in years to come. If Relic keeps their CoH2-like expansion policy with new factions, we may see them sooner than you think.
FearTheReaper
lets point something else out that could mean necrons: "Supremacy must be suspended for survival" This hints at the Blood ravens, Biel-Tan, and Bad moon clan forming a temporary alliance to survive. In DoW 1 no alliance was formed to fight chaos when they attacked. So scratch them off the list. Next we have the tyranids. No alliance was formed between the factions to fight them either, and the eldar actually tried to keep the humans from being able to fight the tyranids to any large extent. Scratch them off the list as well. And now we get to the necrons. The necrons are a race older than the eldar and far more brutal. In fact, for a long time it was frowned upon to even mention the name necron as a member of the imperium. The necrons out number every faction we know of due to the fact that we don't know where their tomb worlds are. The necrons are a bigger threat than chaos out of sheer numbers and technology and are far more intelligent than the tyranid swarms. The Blood Ravens and Biel-Tan would immediately recognize the threat of a necron tomb. The orks maybe stubborn, but they arent complete idiots. The orks would realize that the necrons are a massive threat to their clan. The necrons hold the capability to annihilate a WAAAAAAGH like its made of tissue paper. The Imperiums solution to a necron assault is Exterminatus. The Imperial guard is outnumbered when fighting them. So, they are the most likely enemy
Renner
The worst possible scenario would be "Preorder now to play with Necrons for free", or to buy them later... Even though I'm preordering the game, after all the yelling across the rooftops about 3 playable factions that would be utter bs. But I doubt that will happen, despite we may see some 4th faction in the campaign. Or maybe not, maybe its just some Old Ones artifact, and the common threat becomes Kyre after he gets corrupted with it.
Ellie
im not sure they'd try another day 1 preorder after total warhammers shitstorm. It's probably going to be like winter assault where they'll be the big bad at the end, but not available in the game for a while.
Silk
I understood what you meant, and I knew what Acheron mean. I'm just saying Imperial could have named that planet like this for entirely other reasons. For example, Necromunda (Imperial Hive World) literally means "world of the dead". Quite fitting for Necrons too - but it is not a Tomb World. They may have just chosen this name because... Well, it sounds dark and gritty, and 40k is supposed to be dark and gritty.
100% agree on this.
Wardonno
You can say the same for most RTS games, as stories for RTS are difficult to write. This is mainly because you have to create a reason to have the factions fight each other. Heck, you could say that most video games have terrible stories.
Renner
Like the factions need reasons to fight in the 40k universe where "there is only war", lol. This reminds me on the interview from the Doom developers, where they said some of the testers were asking, like, what is my justification for killing those demons, and the dev is like "Its a flippin' demon, of course you want to kill it..." They focused all the time to develop a fun game, and wrote a story when the game was dangerously nearing the release date.
Or Bioshock Infinite... My God, how disappointed I was with that game, so tedious, repeating... Wherever I mention this always at least 15 dudes jump on my neck calling me names... I played it for a couple of hours and just couldn't make myself to continue. And everyone is like "Just wait till you see the ending, DAT story man, it will change your mind completelly"... And I made myself to play it, and the ending and the story itself really weren't nothing to write home about. Even if it was the greatest story of all time, I still fail to see how is that fixing that the game is #$%&. At least in my humble opinion.
Relic's vanilla DoW games are always having some twist. Orks invading, then it turns out to be Chaos doing, and Maledictum, Isador's betrial, and so on. WA is just fighting over Titan, with a bit of backstabbing near the end. And the Dark Crusade/Soulstorm was just a pure planet conquest, with some mentioning of the Blood Ravens secrets in DC that never got to be revealed. They were also mentioned once by Dreadnought Thule once, and that's about it. Who knows what are they going to throw into mix to surprise those 3 current factions. I hope the game itself will be good. But so far, the most I saw in each faction's mission is destroy these two base camps/something, and that unlocks the 3rd one.
Wardonno
>
That the Internet for you, people want to hear your opinion only if it conforms to the majority. The most important thing Relic can do to make DOW3 success is to just release a game that is fun to play and something that you want to continually come back to. I cannot think of a single game that has every had a brilliant story and shitty game play.
What exactly about the gameplay of Bioshock did you find tedious and repetitive, cause I hated the game solely for restricting you to only two weapons at a time. I felt that restricting the number of weapon you could hold resulted in combat that variety. With one change Bioshock infinite to me would have been a good game. The question now faced is could a single change be made to what we have seen that would result in a improved game.
Renner
It wasn't just a two weapon restriction, its that the every single one felt like a friggen pea-shooter. Reta**ed AI, consolitis of aiming, each level divided into shooty rooms, and AI was restricted and wasn't able to leave the room it was assigned at... Tons of backstracking, even recycling some bosses, immersion breaking moments when you see Elisabeth crouching and everyone is completelly ignoring her while the story is turning around the whole city trying to recapture her.... So much praising for her AI, when she actually doesn't do anything on her own, just throws you the ammo for the weapon you are using at that moment (or health/mana), even if no one who you killed used it... And then the cooldown starts... Then you get killed and she is free to revive you, even though you are surrounded completelly... Watered down RPG elements (if you can even call them like that) and weapon upgrades, bunch of useless vigors of which you are probably going to use one or two...
And Ken Levine disbanded the team just after the game was released. Its like he was saying I had to do it to fill my contract, here, there you have it, now I'm leaving to make some indie games... The product itself certainly felt like that, but hey, it had some hardcore marketing that was preparing us for the second coming of Jesus.... Sorry for the offtopic, but I'm getting taken over blood rage when I mention that game. The final nail in its coffin were its fanboys and unreasonable people demanding that you are talking #$%& just to troll and attract some attention because you like to spit on popular things for those reasons, even if you never did that in the past. What bs.
Gorb
I can't speak for Infinite, but I quite liked the gunplay in the first two. I can't imagine the third one feels that different r.e. weapon mechanics alone (Plasmids are different, mind).
That said, would be nice if we could get back to the theoretical Necrons
I was going to make a conspiracy post about the Old Ones, but it seems new Games Workshop lore is ignoring them completely in favour of Eldar and Imperials doing stuffs.
Renner
Yes, first two games were fine, even though I wasn't snorting them as hard as some other people did. In fact, I grow tired of the Bioshock formula when the second game appeared, since I finished the original once, and stopped at the half of my second playtrough. B2 felt like rethreading the old grounds of which I was bored already. Something similar happened to me with Borderlands series. I cleaned up the first game upwards and downwards completelly, and then the second one I stopped playing after I finished the first quest.... It was mid 2013, and I actually finished it 2 weeks ago... Took me 4 years to make myself to finish it.
You know, things like these are making me to appreciate Relic trying something different from game to game. Ok, I'm done with the offtopic stuff.
Cannibal0145
At first when I read that topic @Doobeedoo I thought "Another crazy necron fan guy" but you really make me think about that, the hieroglyphs in the floor and the quote from necron codex, but im still blieving the chaos and IG have more followers and probably relic make those armies first, I prefere see necrons than those other too and hopefully see tau and necrons in the same expansion
PhilthyPhilPhD
I think Chaos deserves it more but at the same time Necrons have not been done since Dark Crusade and it would be potentially interesting to see what they do with it. If Relic decides to add some races as DLC and some in Expansions I think Necrons would be more appropriate as a DLC and Chaos would be more worthy of their own Expansions because they probably deserve a campaign for/about them.
Doobeedoo
TBH if GW sales are anything to go by, Tau and Admech have tons of followers. Then again I suppose the other races have fans who just aren't buying models.
But I suppose DOW / 40k just doesn't feel complete without Chaos, either.
Also who would the Tau fight? Their main enemies are the Imperium and Tyranids. They don't really have much beef with Chaos and Necrons.
Plus if each expansion has a new big bad enemy, it's gotta be Chaos (destroy the material universe), Tyranids (eat everyone) or Necrons (kill everyone and take back their empire, cut the universe off from the warp).
There's also the problem of having so many human factions, and not wanting to make an expansion that is just human factions. Imperial Guard, Sisters of Battle, Admech, Chaos.
Silk
I don't know if there would be enough units in the Ad-Mech army to make a full faction, that's what worries me the most. Maybe it's possible if you include Forge World 30k units though (I can see a Thanatar elite for example).
I agree with you that the main problem would be having too many Imperial factions. Having 2 imperials armies is enough, 3 or 4 may be stretching. Maybe some armies should be blend together to make it work? Marines could have some support from the Inquisition/Ad-Mech (they already have some Knights), and the Guard could also have some support from the Ecclesiarchy, the Inquisition and the Ad-Mech. Disappointing for fans of those factions, I know, but at least they would make it into the game.
PhilthyPhilPhD
I think a decent number of Ad Mech stuff is supposed to be usable in 40k or will be when the next Imperial Armour comes out? So with the Forgeworld units in mind I do think that Ad Mech has enough for a full fledged army. Then again we don't know how many Elites each faction gets, so maybe they don't have enough? There was a rumour a while back that there will be a few more new Ad Mech units getting added to their line up in terms of new models, if that happens then they'd be even more fleshed out. I guess we'll have to wait and see how DoW3 goes.
Doobeedoo
Take the Eldar in DOW3 as an example: they have 7 elite units, 8 infantry and 3 vehicles.
Admech could have:
Elites:
Archmagos
Techpriest Dominus
Fulgurite Electro-Priests
Corpuscarii Electro-Priests
Imperial Knight Gallant
Imperial Knight Crusader
Infantry:
Skitarii Rangers
Skitrarii Vanguard
Ruststalkers
Sicarian Infiltrators
Kataphron Breachers
Kataphron Destroyers
Vehicles:
Sydonian Dragoon
Ironstrider
Castelan Robot
Onager Dunecrawler - Eradication Beamer
Onager Dunecrawler - Neutron Laser
But this relies heavily on using the same units with different weapons.
PhilthyPhilPhD
Pretty good list, but I've got some we can add, especially if we go under the assumption that they will use 30k units for the Ad Mech which is apparently exactly what is going to happen apparently, like I said I think it's with the next Imperial Armour book.
Here's a few we can use.
Elites:
Instead of Gallants and Crusaders we can use Questoris Knights -
https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-CA/Questoris-Knight-Magaera
https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-CA/Questoris-Knight-Styrix
The Magaera is armed with a Lightning Cannon and has self repair abilties.
The Styrix has a gigantic Volkite gun as well as grav guns and rad cleansers
Heavy Support or Elites
They also have access to loads of battle automata
The Domitar which is a form of close combat automata I think.
https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-CA/Mechanicum-Domitar-Battle-automata
The Thanatar which is a pretty large siege robot that is a heavy support
https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-CA/Mechanicum-Thanatar-Siege-Automata
https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-CA/Thanatar-Calix-Siege-Automata
The Vorax which is a close combat automata
https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-CA/Mechanicum-Vorax-Battle-Automata
The Castellax which is a large automata intended for shock assaults and sieging
https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-CA/Mechanicum-Castellax-Battle-Automata-with-Multi-melta
https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-CA/Mechanicum-Castellax-Battle-Automata-with-Darkfire-Cannon
https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-CA/Mechanicum-Castellax-Battle-Automata
The Krios which is basically a tank/gun on treads, in case the Ad Mech need one
https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-CA/Mechanicum-Krios-Battle-Tank
Line Units
The Thallax is basically a heavy infantry, basically a bit better in terms of toughness than space marines if I recall. Possible late game infantry?
https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-CA/Mechanicum-Thallax-Cohort
Basically a jump pack CC version of the Thallax more or less.
https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-CA/Mechanicum-Ursarax-FW
I hope you guys don't mind me providing links, it's one thing to talk about a robot or whatever and say how it would fit but I think it can be even more useful to see the models and think of how they fit in to the army in terms of aesthetics and feel.
grndmrshlgando
I noticed each faction so far has some kind of gameplay mechanic that identifies them and sets them apart from the others. space marines use drop pods, eldar teleports and can move their bases around, and orks use scrap to upgrade their units and power abilities
I wonder what necrons' gameplay mechanic would include? I imagine it would revolve around power a bit like in DOW1
on that note I think chaos would revolve around corruption or something to that effect. like their units corrupt parts of the map kind of like the zerg in starcraft? I really wish they made it into dow3 (vanilla at least)