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Relic could actually address most of its criticisms
darkyjaz95
Despite the hate this game is getting, Relic could actually address most of them without affecting existing gameplay
None of the changes below would affect gameplay greatly IMO.
And I dont think any 40K or DOW fans would disagree to any changes i listed below, it just seems to me Relic are just too lazy to implement them.
Camera- Free the camera so players could zoom/rotate like in previous DOWs, prob takes changes to no more than a dozen line of codes.
Voice acting - Get the original VAs back.
Lore wise- Eg No more exaggerated movements such as flipping terminators, change it to teleporting or something else...
Over simplified Bubble shield covers - fixed with more cover types, eg directional covers and etc
Cartoonish style - fixed with super detailed unit models, grim dark art style and better/more detailed animations.
No sync kills - fixed with better and bloody melee animations and quick gruesome death animations like in starcraft 2.
Lack of content - more maps/units and a 4th race, like in the old DOWs.
Comments
darkyjaz95
What Relic actually did:
Change VAs for no reasons.
Gameplay inspired by MOBA no problem all good, but also made the art direction more similar to MOBA, which means more colorful pattern, more exaggerated movements, more flashy effects, less detailed units/maps, less animations.
Cut out an entire race, but the 3 remaining factions only has 11-12 line units. Space marines doesnt even have Land Raiders...
Orblivion
The voice acting isn't necessarily Relic's decision. If the original voice actors were/are not available, then that's your answer.
darkyjaz95
And what about everything else I mentioned?
Orblivion
Have been argued to death already, I have nothing to add to any of those discussions.
Renner
Its interesting to see that Brian Dobson is in the cast, which makes me wondering why he isn't voicing Gabe like in DoW2 vanilla (that was him, if I'm not mistaken). He's a lot closer to his brother Paul's Gabriel than this one. Unless they maybe wanted it this way, maybe they found the old Gabriel being "too soft" for the newly appointed Chapter Master who's wearing a terminator armor.
But if that's not the case, they can always do a little fan service and do a recast when Paul is available. If nothing, I'm happy that Brian is in there for The Orks
darkyjaz95
The point is that the ones i mentioned are merely cosmetic changes, don't think any DOW fans would be unhappy about them.
Then the million dollar question is, why did Relic not implement them despite the backlash from a lot of the communities?
Creature
For most of them, I think it would be better to say they "could have" done these things. I suppose they maybe/could theoretically delay the game, put out more money for new voice actors, and then release later with new voice actors. But... well, the game has gone gold and the story lines etc, have already been recorded.
I personally like the voice actors anyway. Re-recording them might please you and many others, but then they'd have my complaints to deal with. Haha.
I agree about the camera suggestion. Very easy fix and would be optional for those who don't want to accidentally trigger the camera to zoom too close in the middle of the fight. I have zoom toggled off as I play. Wouldn't bother me at all if others could move the camera around more freely.
The game is actually releasing with more maps than DoW2 did on release. There is one less race. The current races get more elites and the addition of doctrines. It's a trade-off. I'm not sure which has more content precisely, but it's pretty close between the two, imo.
The animations and such are another thing that would cost money and not please everyone. But I think they could maybe introduce like a brown/gray filter for people to apply to darken things up and that might be a good compromise? Giving more "grimdark" paint options such as "chipped paint" might also be good.
Gorb
In my opinion, you seem to be asking for reverts to a lot of changes that were explicitly made for gameplay reasons.
This is naturally therefore going to have an impact on gameplay.
The camera angle one is the only seem that seems like a quick and easy win (assuming there aren't complications).
WarbossGogangash
Yea, but sadly only for one type of unit.
aWildUPSMan
A lot of what you are asking requires an overhaul of the systems that are already implemented and being shipped with the game.
The Camera is the only one in which I would agree with you.
Renner
Sluggas and Deffguns, if I'm not mistaken.
WarbossGogangash
No only just sluggas. I think the lootas are the same guy who does the weirdboy.
Johnbonne
Camera: I don't know the current situation of the camera, but if there's any locks to it I wouldn't mind them being removed. It really depends on how they're doing fog of war. Otherwise I'm hoping we'll be allowed to enter the .ini files and change things that way, or use console commands.
VAs: Voice actors charge a fair bit for their services especially with how valuable they are nowadays, and to redo all the dialogue or at least the important stuff (but what's important is debatable) would cost too much time. Who knows, they may appear in future expansions if they're not working on other projects or retiring from the profession.
Lore-wise: How would they do that now? And besides, it's widely debated that a lot of this stuff is possible. I don't believe it nor do I like the answers, but I'll look into it more to justify it. That said, I eagerly await to see how the game tries to tell me how these things came to be.
Bubble Shields: I don't think bubble shields are oversimplified, but I would say it's streamlined to better suit this game. Bubbleshields can be useful when you're in a jam. I do like the cover mechanic for DoW2 when I had fewer units to manage, but bubbleshields would allow me to be more active with my characters. Adding cover would mean needing to rework maps and their design, suppression rules and unit placement. It'd be a big hassle for the base game, but I can see it being a fun addtion to future expansions.
Continued below (1/2)
Johnbonne
(Continued from above post 2/2)
Art style: Not going to comment, there's far too much for me to say that has been in other threads. Not to mention changing that is far, far from a matter of laziness. Having said that, you're more than welcome to add it to your list of critiques.
No sync kills: Fair does. Was the reason they were removed due to the invulnerability? If so I can understand that, but why not have them in PvE?
Lack of content: You don't know how much quality time the campaign offers, or what the other maps besides those revealed in beta are. If you do, I'd appreciate knowing your sources unless the Closed Beta offers more than open. If there are less maps than previous entries I can understand the frustration, but I'd rather that and one less faction to balance than a complete mess. If this is enough to put you off I strongly advise waiting for a sale.
I'm not going to put any of this down to laziness, but I wouldn't be surprised if SEGA were breathing down the devs' neck to keep some things for expansions later on.
Renner
I don't know, they sound really Brian-ish to me, ever since I watched videos of the campaign with them, not to mention when I actually played it personally.
Emilqt
less animations? have you looked at both dow1 and 2, for range units there is none animations at all while in mobas there is as much animation as there is needed eg, attack, idle, spell. and the terminators to teleport
Emilqt
the reason to remove sync kills was to become more esport, and one important aspect of esport if have to be reactive, and when a unit stand still for 5 seconds to kill someone of, when you cant controll it when/if it happen, it creates a major problem. if you could controll every sync kills, and the unit would still take damage when they do it, it would be another story, but then another problem would come up, why would you want to take extra time to kill someone off when you can just shoot them down.i a agree that sync kills look ++heresy redacted++ cool, but i also found it quite annoying when it happend in the previous games and i tried to spamm click my units away and it wouldnt work
WarbossGogangash
First I thought the same when I only saw the campign video, but after I got into the beta I heard that they have a really similar voice to the weirdboy, you'll see in the open beta.
ValKor01
Why should Relic address criticisms that mostly come from people who have not played the game at all?
No matter what they do people will criticise because people hold different opinions, the game would never get finished if all they did was change things due to people criticising.
The reason they haven't changed anything is because they have their own vision for what the game should be and they are following through with it. Which is the same reason for why they didnt make changes to DoW2 regarding base building, larger army sizes etc before the game released.
Charon
It's nice to hear for the first time for a while but I'd wager that most people eventually turn it off in favour of their own music. In any case it's simplicity itself to have the original DoW 1 and 2 soundtracks playing in the background if you wish.
Czevak
I hope this game's soundtrack has the same epicness of the second game, as the music in that truly made some of the larger fights much more intense. I HAVE heard some sort of in game soundtrack on people's streams, but on a very quiet volume.
Navinor
I am really just to tired to discuss these things over and over and OVER again.
I like the new art style.
I like how the races are made.
I like the fact you can not rush your oponent within the first second
The people complaining over the game do not even have looked at ANY longer multiplayer footage!
They would not buy the game anyway.
We have 2017. Not 2009! Really, it is time to grow up! Time is moving on.
Do not like it? Do not buy it!
THANK YOU!
darkyjaz95
I get it.
You like Gabriels new VA.
You like the more streamlined cover system.
You like the removal of things like morale.
You like the cartoonish art style with back flipping terminators.
You like the lack of line units.
You like the fact there are only 3 races.
Well, good for you.
darkyjaz95
Yes. You're right. Problem for me is the lack of epic themes like in DOW1. Seen plenty streams already but didnt hear something like IG theme/SM theme/Force Commander theme in the vDOW.
What do you think about the changes I mentioned to aspects other than the sounds?
Wa2Magge
Well, there are enough line Units in the game, 11-13 line Units for every race, + 9 Elite Units for all of the 3 Races, thats not bad.
and im sure that relic will add more line Units in FREE-LC´s or Expansion/DLC´s
darkyjaz95
Why, because it's a Warhammer game. Not a warhammer skinned generic RTS game.
If Creative Assembly can represent the Warhammer universe faithfully(at least art wise) in their games, why cant relic?
darkyjaz95
Easy to fix. Have death animations like in starcraft2. And better melee animations.
darkyjaz95
Since devs only has to work on 3 races now ,I was expecting dark crusade's numbers for the line units. Plus I feel that some line units are a bit redundant, like having normal scouts and sniper scouts as separate units ,instead of an upgrade.