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Eldar completely unplayable post-patch
2 years ago
Don_Zauser
Thanks relic... just had a couple of matches... Eldar are completely useless in tier 1
2
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Thanks relic... just had a couple of matches... Eldar are completely useless in tier 1
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Quitt
Aaaaand here we go, I was sure I'll see guys like you pop up.
"Duuuh, I used to stomp everyone with this OP strat and now it is no longer OP so I cannot stomp because I cannot think on my own, duurrr hurrr. Thanks Obama"
Atramentar
I wondering ... How we can play now our T1 ? Early game is dead for us
Where is my T1 ?
What's can i play now in early game ?
Well Well Well...... Thanks Relic for this.
Now it's balanced
Quitt
Not sure what you mean here - you know you can still build them in T1, right?
But still pretty bonkers
They are ranged, have free grenade, and under fleet of foot you can't catch them without gap closers
The quick strike dealt waaaaay too much dmg
So now you actually have to do something to get the generator instead of having it for free
Here I agree that this cost increase was uncalled for. Their dmg is kinda meh, they die from a fart in their direction, and to make them work you have to mass them. Now you cannot mass them. Is still good for recon i guess
Have you ever heard about a concept called "combined arms"? You cannot expect to field just one mass unit and stomp everyone.
I'm not saying that Eldar changes are 100% spot on. I think that the majority of these changes were justified and that you're overreacting
Atramentar
I'm not saying that Eldar DON'T NEED nerf
I just saying it's overnerf ...IMO
Burninalways
Completely agree that Eldar are broken after patch.
Dire Avenger damage has been gutted, can't even kill an Engineer before their weapons overheat, and you need 3 teams to beat 1 team of Tactical Marine.
Fixs:
Remove overheat from Dire Avengers while stationary.
Allow Dire Avengers to fire on the move yet doing so causes their weapons to overheat, being stationary for xs purges all remaining overheat.
After dealing damage to the enemy for xs the enemy receives a, non-stacking, debuff increasing damage taken by x% from Dire Avengers.
Rangers are too costly to produce and are quick to die, forcing you to delay your tech upgrades. No Idea why Rangers got a nerf and Scout Snipers didn't get touch as they were the main problem with mass snipers. Eldar need to unlock before they can even produce a single unit of Rangers, while Scout Snipers have reduced cost and greater range. Never saw Rangers on mass, just Scout Snipers.
TheDukeofDirty
Guys the Dire Avenger DAMAGE didnt get nerfed. It was the RANGE.
"Dire Avenger
Range reduced from 40 to 30"
Eventide
Totally agree that Eldar are virtually unplayable now T1. Quitt, you are just being a fool. I agree, most of these nerfs were needed, after a fashion. Now the issue is though, that while it used to be completely OP, even with a mix, the Eldar T1 are virtually useless. Grenades do no damage, you can no longer interrupt flamer with grenade, you have to use a bonesinger. Everything else you use will literally die as soon as you see the flame mechanic. Against good people, there is no give. You are forced to turtle to get to T2, or just throw units away and hope T2 saves you. On the off chance that you DO completely out play somebody with your flimsy mix of units, they get 35% back phase 1. If they catch on to your tactics, or you make one wrong move, all of your squads are dead immediately, and your push was for nothing.
Quitt
Dunno at which patch notes you're looking, but it says
Ranged Damage: 40 -> 30
I still think 30 for the starting combat unit is super strong. Don't forget about free and strong grenade, FoF and Combat focus. Damage is not everything.
Burninalways
Tactical Marine damage and health got increased while Dire Avenger damage and shield got decreased, and Dire Avenger are no good at melee so they did get nerfed times 2.
frumpylumps
Anecdotal, but Cataclaw beat #1 Ork player Koof 3x in a row as of this post, so perhaps saying they are completely unplayable is a bit premature.
Guziol
Check the in game dps. it's same as pre patch.
Svanh
Dire Avenger DPS and shield didn't get changed. The changes were to their range (reduced from 40 to 30, now same as Tacticals and Shootas) and the Improved Dire Avenger Shield doctrine (reduced from +20% to +10%). You can check the game files.
PaperBaG
Against SM they are, and yea this is coming from a ~top 50 ish 1v1 player who didn't abuse the broken meta I lost all my games vs SM today tried 3 different builds none worked...why was the standard buffed? Heavy nerf to singer teleport but SM still can deploy drop pod right off the bat then buff already tanky buffed units with a shield in the first couple minutes to take early map control...what can u do now? 1 misclick and you get insta wipe by flamer from either the kill team or the tacs that people are spamming now, that's if you havn't already gotten hit by the vortex grenade or the drop pod or the standard lol you have to avoid like 5-6 things to keep squads alive early
Quitt
Whoa, whoa, whoa, calm your nuts. OP and others definitely overreact with "Eldar T1 is useless". No need to call names here
My opinion differs. I still think Eldar T1 is their strongest tier (dunno how T3 looks now with improved Fire Prism). Flamers are great against immobile targets (it has a 'cooldown' between attacks, and cannot change attack direction as far as I know). And guess what, Eldar are all but immobile. You cannot just expect to make a frontal charge assault on flamer tacs and hope to get on top. That how it was pre patch and it was just broken. For his one tacs with flamer, you have almost 2 DA (too lazy to do the maths now). Just don't blob them and you'll be fine.
Also, whenever you're making such strong claims (that something is useless and stands no chance against X), you should at least make a VERY STRONG case example - but really you should just post a replay. Remember that the majority of players are unable to differentiate between balance issues and just straight skill difference between players in a match
kickinleg
I would've liked them to keep webway relocate on T1; it's fun to play, gives mobility, takes some multitasking etc.. I don't think it'll be as imbalanced with the nerfed dire avengers and some other nerfs.
More to the point: Even before the patch ppl realized how strong the Ghost-dude-Specters really are at killing objectives and other buildings as well as for example trukks, landspeeders etc. and have played them very early after 3-4 DA squads and 1-2 LP's (Saw cata use them frequently against orks before patch and bikerush immediately after patch mentioned: "Specters is where it's at now." on his stream. You can have 1-2 out by the time Orks hit you with 2-3 trukks and completely devastate the trucks and then go for objectives. I don't know much about the MU vs SM, it might be more problematic there. At least you can kill objectives with them and prepare for landspeeders and other vehicles etc.
They aren't very good against other stuff, but the range is insane and they are floating around, so they still have some viability in fights against non-structure/heavy armored stuff.
HohesHaus
If they had at least buffed the vyper but it is still useless. Spectres are still useless, because they die like flies and for that they're too expensive.
While SM got buffed through the roof, Eldar only got nerfes.
Don_Zauser
LOL I just played 1v1 match vs SM... I was struggling all the time... a defensive SM player who knows what he's doing is just unbeatable. He started to mass sniper scouts. Then he got whirlwinds, backed by devastators (heavy bolter and lascannons) etc. and it was GG... don't know how to counter all this imba ++heresy redacted++
So basically eldar can't do ++heresy redacted++ vs SM in tier 1, can't do nothing in tier 2, and just gets melted in tier 3
Diogen84
Prisms now melt everything. And now they are cheaper with higher range. So you have some for t3
Fww
Even if they didn't nerf DAs damage it's still silly that tacts get the same dps and don't need to deal with "cooling" their weapons.
The price difference isn't big neither
Early game sucks now since you don't have speed nor you can stay in battle because you get melted.
MetalSlime
Yea, as an Ork player I definitely see what you pointy-heads mean. Eldar used to be a good fight pre-patch, lots of sneaky stabbin' and fast runnin'. With the nerfs, I would like to see the Webway teleport moved back to t1 as I feel DAs with a speed buff (within webway aoe) and lower range would actually be a good spot for them. Especially with lower Webway health and a slightly longer teleport time to make it easier to punish if the gate is not hidden.
As it stands, I can just stomp all over your boyz. The only thing that slows my green tide are Reapers, but then its just a matter of getting a trukk or two out. Not that I am complaining, I like to win, but I like even more to have a good fight, win or lose.
epIx
eldar is unplayable, dont even try
relic caters to crying orks and space marines they make up 2/3 of the community
its called Marketing-management
I dont wanna read comments from some #358 orks or marines in other threads talkin like they actually understand the game xD such a joke tbh^
switch races or uninstall the game - thats my advice
TheDukeofDirty
Body is 10 characters too short.
PaperBaG
Put drop pod/standard on cooldown to start and buff banshee base stats a tiny bit or make their screams have a similar effect to what a blind/stun grenade does so tacs can't just "walk away"
Quitt
I just played Eldar and they are playable, what do you mean?
TOGgledShot
I darn near spit out my drink when I read this. lol
TOGgledShot
I will say this once again. I'd love to see replays of all this "Eldar is crap" stuff.
Sometimes it's not about the fault of the Unit or Race, but the fault of the player using said Unit or Race. I'm not saying you suck, but Replays can show more context than blabbing that something is unplayable.
Quitt
Oh, you better watch out. When in a similar thread I said "Replay or it didn't happen", I was immediately attacked that it is me who should provide a replay showing that Eldar do not suck
PaperBaG
https://www.gamereplays.org/dawnofwar3/replays.php?game=95&show=details&id=321259 Here's a good one, i can't even kill a servitor before my shields are gone, tacs with standard can just hangout and tank crazy amount of dmg, for perspective the SM is ranked top 25 1v1 and me ~50
TOGgledShot
I'm not worried. I've been saying that since before the patch. I have a thread dedicated to it. haha There was a time when people got upset that I asked that they validate their claim. Prolly cause their replay had a potential to show that they just don't know how to play, vs. using the correct strat.
I'm not here to judge anyone, but if you going to make claims I would suggest backing it up with evidence so that people AND RELIC can see what you are talking about. Baseless claims aren't helpful without video proof. It thinned out the hoards of people crying about their problems real fast. I'm not asking for replays to run people off, I'm sure their claims are valid, but if you have people disagreeing with you, show me what you see. We can then help if you have trouble.
Solomon
100% spot on.