It's horrible to have a big career shift but it's good he is still occupied in the same area. I think the framework for DoW3 is very good and should be applauded. Only questionable decision imo is the economy system, I don't understand it and it stresses me. For example, is it worth upgrading nodes, does it ever pay to get an elite point node etc. It also makes the AI scaling wonky so the new players are confused.
A bit of a fresh perspective can be great if supported but PB can be quite proud of the basic game he laid out.
That's really good to know, I can throw you into the bin with rest of completely deluded fools.
Cut down on your ArchWarhammer doses, that stuff isn't good for your mental health.
@WorlockOrk, I understand you, but what if Dow4 will be equallly or even much worse than Dow3? You will wait for Dow5 then?
I'm happy that Dow3 was ever released, even if its situation doesn't look promising. But hey, maybe it will be not abandoned so quickly, because, well Relic wouldn't be himself to abandon newly released product so quickly.
That's really good to know, I can throw you into the bin with rest of completely deluded fools.
Cut down on your ArchWarhammer doses, that stuff isn't good for your mental health.
What mental health ? You live in your world of arrogance and egoism. I stated dancing angelos as exemple just because every time when you comment on dow fans you are using this exemple. But the game as itself is empty of any features and it lacks everything to be respectable dow game. The reality is that you are defending the game just because you like it .
The point is that we can do better and that something needs to be learned from this debacle. We should prepare the terrain for something better instead of reading your heresy.
Let me point this out now:
These DoW/40k fans are incapable of accepting cybernetically enhanced chapter master with custom terminator armor doing flips, but are perfectly fine with stuff like 2nd company commander murdering mercilessly bloodthirster with a broken sword, or having a singular guardsmen ambush and obliterate great ork forces all by himself, or the fact that unnamed random terminators are doing backflips in GW approved and published books.
If that isn't utter hypocrisy, then I don't know what is.
People are raging about Gabe, because they have no ++heresy redacted++ idea what they want, all they know is that they don't like some aspect of the game that has absolutely ZERO impact on gameplay. Yes, these people are ignorant fools.
The reality is, you are attacking the game because you cling to nostalgia of previous titles and are incapable of treating DoW3 as a new entry to the series.
The game WILL become better with time, when relic starts to release new factions, possibly new elites, new better designed maps.
Relic was never really good at "listening" to players, whole history of CoH2 patching is a solid proof for that.
They always go own original way, never making same thing twice.
Even identical at first glance CoH1 and CoH2 have so many differences that there is some crowd of CoH1 fans that never got over it and stayed in CoH1.
If you particularly loved one entry from relic series, you better stick to that entry, because they are not blizzard, EA, activision or ubisoft and they don't do the exact same thing over and over and over and over again until braindead communities finally start suspecting that 10th entry into the IP is a tad too similar to 9 previous (CoD, Fifa, assassins creed and so on).
@Draconix said: @WorlockOrk, I understand you, but what if Dow4 will be equallly or even much worse than Dow3? You will wait for Dow5 then?
I'm happy that Dow3 was ever released, even if its situation doesn't look promising. But hey, maybe it will be not abandoned so quickly, because, well Relic wouldn't be himself to abandon newly released product so quickly.
I just think that the community is key for next dow game. I think relic should listen more and consider the opinions and criticizm from community. If not, they will alway finish by seling Justin Beiber in the Mozarts package which is not correct towards Mozart fans.
Fans are important, but truth is, that in current times money is the most important thing in entire industry. I think it is natural that corporations care about money, because it is what for they exist - to earn money. Fans comes second after it.
The 'community' don't want an RTS game, so I think it's better if Relic drop DoW. I'd rather Relic continue being one of the big two remaining RTS game producers (assuming Blizzard will make WC4).
The 'community' wants an real time tabletop simulator because they can't afford to play tabletop (in terms of time, money, friends etc.). I'm from Nottingham, I remember getting that original Rogue Trader book in the 80s from Games Workshop when I was a kid on a day out shopping with my 20 pounds pocket money. Ahh the nostalgia, who'd have thought that such a thing would spawn an army of entitled whiny neckbeards 30 years later.
@WorlockOrk said:
When nothingam noobs make their way in premier leaague your expectation will raise and you will understand that dow3 could be a better game. I know than between watching a footbal game in second class division and playing dow3 is same thing. I finally understood why you like this game.
The Nottingham thing is just a reference to that being where GW was (and still is) based. i think there were only lvery few GW stores in the UK back then. So I stumbled across 40K just because it was in a nerdy shop with cool pictures and books and models. So I've always been a bit proud of GW but to be honest I'm not so much anymore due to the type of people they attract.
I've not been a fan of Nottingham Forest since we had Brian Clough so you are right, they are an embarrassment.
@LadderGoat said:
Definitely for the best - his demeanor in interviews was awful, he came across SO smarmy and unlikable. Furthermore, his choices made as a Game Director is what put Dawn of War 3 in the pickle it's in now.
And there I was, thinking it was under founding and hard deadlines by Sega.
THQ at least was always generous when it came to Relic.
It must be easy for Relic devs to hate their "fans" with this disgusting level of bias and blind impudence.
Which fans ? Are you refering to dow3 lovers ? They made the game for them. Dow fans were excluded from this sequel. So if you blame fans, I presume that you are reffering to relics "new fans".
Who are you kid? I play Dawn of war since vanilla 1.2 in 2004 so less plz, I am a old fan and I am still here
With over 2k hours played in DoW1 and 2 and all of their expansion I can only +1 you on this one Bigamo.
Oups, I'm sorry I didin't want to offend anyone. I would put you in the category of new fans. You are more like chaos space marines. The warp delusion is feeding your soul while you are trying to use the chains of torment on new players and dow fans.
Humorous, however, I dont see how they made this game for DOW3 lovers, how could someone love DOW3 before the beta was released. IMO, This game was a clear indication that they had their fun with DOW2 and Philippe who just left, brought us back in the right direction...
As for his "Demeanor".. dude wtf lol
No hate for the guy hes done a good job, all we need now is to hope that someone as in Love with the game as we are steps up to bring us the other 6 races over the next 4 years ;]
@LadderGoat said:
Definitely for the best - his demeanor in interviews was awful, he came across SO smarmy and unlikable. Furthermore, his choices made as a Game Director is what put Dawn of War 3 in the pickle it's in now.
And there I was, thinking it was under founding and hard deadlines by Sega.
THQ at least was always generous when it came to Relic.
It must be easy for Relic devs to hate their "fans" with this disgusting level of bias and blind impudence.
Which fans ? Are you refering to dow3 lovers ? They made the game for them. Dow fans were excluded from this sequel. So if you blame fans, I presume that you are reffering to relics "new fans".
Who are you kid? I play Dawn of war since vanilla 1.2 in 2004 so less plz, I am a old fan and I am still here
With over 2k hours played in DoW1 and 2 and all of their expansion I can only +1 you on this one Bigamo.
Oups, I'm sorry I didin't want to offend anyone. I would put you in the category of new fans. You are more like chaos space marines. The warp delusion is feeding your soul while you are trying to use the chains of torment on new players and dow fans.
Humorous, however, I dont see how they made this game for DOW3 lovers, how could someone love DOW3 before the beta was released. IMO, This game was a clear indication that they had their fun with DOW2 and Philippe who just left, brought us back in the right direction...
As for his "Demeanor".. dude wtf lol
No hate for the guy hes done a good job, all we need now is to hope that someone as in Love with the game as we are steps up to bring us the other 6 races over the next 4 years ;]
I'm guessing you never saw the smarmy interview with Leutin? Don't "dude wtf" me. It's a perfectly legitimate observation.
I'm sure DOW2 sold more units than DOW3 in this timescale.
Regarding it bringing DOW back in the right direction... You really think this is the right direction? DOW3 doesn't even look likely to have an expansion.
@LadderGoat said:
Definitely for the best - his demeanor in interviews was awful, he came across SO smarmy and unlikable. Furthermore, his choices made as a Game Director is what put Dawn of War 3 in the pickle it's in now.
And there I was, thinking it was under founding and hard deadlines by Sega.
THQ at least was always generous when it came to Relic.
It must be easy for Relic devs to hate their "fans" with this disgusting level of bias and blind impudence.
Which fans ? Are you refering to dow3 lovers ? They made the game for them. Dow fans were excluded from this sequel. So if you blame fans, I presume that you are reffering to relics "new fans".
Who are you kid? I play Dawn of war since vanilla 1.2 in 2004 so less plz, I am a old fan and I am still here
With over 2k hours played in DoW1 and 2 and all of their expansion I can only +1 you on this one Bigamo.
Oups, I'm sorry I didin't want to offend anyone. I would put you in the category of new fans. You are more like chaos space marines. The warp delusion is feeding your soul while you are trying to use the chains of torment on new players and dow fans.
Humorous, however, I dont see how they made this game for DOW3 lovers, how could someone love DOW3 before the beta was released. IMO, This game was a clear indication that they had their fun with DOW2 and Philippe who just left, brought us back in the right direction...
As for his "Demeanor".. dude wtf lol
No hate for the guy hes done a good job, all we need now is to hope that someone as in Love with the game as we are steps up to bring us the other 6 races over the next 4 years ;]
I'm guessing you never saw the smarmy interview with Leutin? Don't "dude wtf" me. It's a perfectly legitimate observation.
I'm sure DOW2 sold more units than DOW3 in this timescale.
Regarding it bringing DOW back in the right direction... You really think this is the right direction? DOW3 doesn't even look likely to have an expansion.
Alright man well if he was so bad you need not worry because hes gone, and to be honest yeah, DOW2 sucked, I much prefer this, my ONLY problems are the balance with Eldar being unplayable at higher level.
I have a lot of hope that there will be a future for DOW3, I think you do too.. why else would you be here ?
He acted like a know-it-all. He said that every single point made by the community is either wrong or non-existent. He acted towards Wh40k IP like it is made and loved by crazy people. ''Who cares what I do with it, there are yellow supermen in it and ppl still like it'' is a paraphrase of one of his interviews.
Therefore them letting him go is nothing unexpected and I say good riddance.
@Mr_Ruin said:
He acted like a know-it-all. He said that every single point made by the community is either wrong or non-existent. He acted towards Wh40k IP like it is made and loved by crazy people. ''Who cares what I do with it, there are yellow supermen in it and ppl still like it'' is a paraphrase of one of his interviews.
Therefore them letting him go is nothing unexpected and I say good riddance.
That's a great attitude. His job is to design an RTS game. I keep saying this, Relic don't make your fantasy toys.
@Draconix said: @WorlockOrk, I understand you, but what if Dow4 will be equallly or even much worse than Dow3? You will wait for Dow5 then?
I'm happy that Dow3 was ever released, even if its situation doesn't look promising. But hey, maybe it will be not abandoned so quickly, because, well Relic wouldn't be himself to abandon newly released product so quickly.
I just think that the community is key for next dow game. I think relic should listen more and consider the opinions and criticizm from community. If not, they will alway finish by seling Justin Beiber in the Mozarts package which is not correct towards Mozart fans.
Fans are important, but truth is, that in current times money is the most important thing in entire industry. I think it is natural that corporations care about money, because it is what for they exist - to earn money. Fans comes second after it.
Building a game with the community is possible. Risky if you are a big studio, but you could reach a success story : Best example : Endless Legends And Endless Space of Amplitude studio : games are just crafted hand to hand with community, and the result is awesome. Now, amplitude was bought by Sega, cause, this society becomes really interesting for any publishers. And sega lets (for instance) Amplitude act as before.
So Amplitude works with community, it brings a lot of benefits, and money ... enough to be predated by big publishers. SEGA is happy, they earn money on it.
So in fact, it is always the same : you can earn money if you work with passion, and a lot. And passion can be alone with your own idea, or with community. The most important is to not think about money first, but passion. If you do it correctly, then money will flow (even if you don't act for this at the beggining).
This story is the same for Blizzard, when they launch Warcraft1-2 and Starcraft. Passion, passion and passion.
@Draconix said: @WorlockOrk, I understand you, but what if Dow4 will be equallly or even much worse than Dow3? You will wait for Dow5 then?
I'm happy that Dow3 was ever released, even if its situation doesn't look promising. But hey, maybe it will be not abandoned so quickly, because, well Relic wouldn't be himself to abandon newly released product so quickly.
I just think that the community is key for next dow game. I think relic should listen more and consider the opinions and criticizm from community. If not, they will alway finish by seling Justin Beiber in the Mozarts package which is not correct towards Mozart fans.
Fans are important, but truth is, that in current times money is the most important thing in entire industry. I think it is natural that corporations care about money, because it is what for they exist - to earn money. Fans comes second after it.
Building a game with the community is possible. Risky if you are a big studio, but you could reach a success story : Best example : Endless Legends And Endless Space of Amplitude studio : games are just crafted hand to hand with community, and the result is awesome. Now, amplitude was bought by Sega, cause, this society becomes really interesting for any publishers. And sega lets (for instance) Amplitude act as before.
So Amplitude works with community, it brings a lot of benefits, and money ... enough to be predated by big publishers. SEGA is happy, they earn money on it.
So in fact, it is always the same : you can earn money if you work with passion, and a lot. And passion can be alone with your own idea, or with community. The most important is to not think about money first, but passion. If you do it correctly, then money will flow (even if you don't act for this at the beggining).
This story is the same for Blizzard, when they launch Warcraft1-2 and Starcraft. Passion, passion and passion.
Hmmm.......makes sense. But unfortunately everything can change as time passes. Same with Blizzard, even they becamed too greedy, especially in case of Hots which I played for 2 years.
Passion is effective, but it can't always replace human's greed, which is a part of their nature, sadly.
@Mr_Ruin said:
He acted like a know-it-all. He said that every single point made by the community is either wrong or non-existent. He acted towards Wh40k IP like it is made and loved by crazy people. ''Who cares what I do with it, there are yellow supermen in it and ppl still like it'' is a paraphrase of one of his interviews.
Therefore them letting him go is nothing unexpected and I say good riddance.
That's a great attitude. His job is to design an RTS game. I keep saying this, Relic don't make your fantasy toys.
I don't even own a single model. It is not about ''fantasy toys'' it is about disrespecting the IP you are using. Same as if you gave a gun to Batman in a video game or added rocket launchers to F1 cause who cares, it's a game. You can do it, but someone will notice.
If you cannot at least respect the IP, then make a game without it with your own units and names etc. As Blizzard did. But Relic took the middle road, ''who cares about the IP but we still need it cause making new units is hard and expensive''.
If we compare him to Relics other game director, I prefered Quinn Duffys approach to Coh2, making the game more similar to the first one.
Philippe Boulle decided or allowed to remove too many things that I liked about DoW like alot of weapon upgrades on sqauds, sqaud leaders, armor and weapon types.
Dawn of war 3 feels to me like a child off Starcraft (army designs, two armor types, ect.) and LoL (grass cover, victory condition, art style) with the only thing being similar to Dawn of war being the squads.
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Comments
Brichals
It's horrible to have a big career shift but it's good he is still occupied in the same area. I think the framework for DoW3 is very good and should be applauded. Only questionable decision imo is the economy system, I don't understand it and it stresses me. For example, is it worth upgrading nodes, does it ever pay to get an elite point node etc. It also makes the AI scaling wonky so the new players are confused.
A bit of a fresh perspective can be great if supported but PB can be quite proud of the basic game he laid out.
Katitof
What kind of insanity levels have you hit to actually believe that if something fails in a business then its a great idea to do it again?
Newsflash: If DoW3 is a "failure" then there will be no DoW4 ever.
Some people really do live in their own reality...
Katitof
That's what you're salty about?
That's really good to know, I can throw you into the bin with rest of completely deluded fools.
Cut down on your ArchWarhammer doses, that stuff isn't good for your mental health.
Draconix
@WorlockOrk, I understand you, but what if Dow4 will be equallly or even much worse than Dow3? You will wait for Dow5 then?
I'm happy that Dow3 was ever released, even if its situation doesn't look promising. But hey, maybe it will be not abandoned so quickly, because, well Relic wouldn't be himself to abandon newly released product so quickly.
Katitof
Let me point this out now:
These DoW/40k fans are incapable of accepting cybernetically enhanced chapter master with custom terminator armor doing flips, but are perfectly fine with stuff like 2nd company commander murdering mercilessly bloodthirster with a broken sword, or having a singular guardsmen ambush and obliterate great ork forces all by himself, or the fact that unnamed random terminators are doing backflips in GW approved and published books.
If that isn't utter hypocrisy, then I don't know what is.
People are raging about Gabe, because they have no ++heresy redacted++ idea what they want, all they know is that they don't like some aspect of the game that has absolutely ZERO impact on gameplay. Yes, these people are ignorant fools.
The reality is, you are attacking the game because you cling to nostalgia of previous titles and are incapable of treating DoW3 as a new entry to the series.
The game WILL become better with time, when relic starts to release new factions, possibly new elites, new better designed maps.
Katitof
Relic was never really good at "listening" to players, whole history of CoH2 patching is a solid proof for that.
They always go own original way, never making same thing twice.
Even identical at first glance CoH1 and CoH2 have so many differences that there is some crowd of CoH1 fans that never got over it and stayed in CoH1.
If you particularly loved one entry from relic series, you better stick to that entry, because they are not blizzard, EA, activision or ubisoft and they don't do the exact same thing over and over and over and over again until braindead communities finally start suspecting that 10th entry into the IP is a tad too similar to 9 previous (CoD, Fifa, assassins creed and so on).
Draconix
Fans are important, but truth is, that in current times money is the most important thing in entire industry. I think it is natural that corporations care about money, because it is what for they exist - to earn money. Fans comes second after it.
Brichals
The 'community' don't want an RTS game, so I think it's better if Relic drop DoW. I'd rather Relic continue being one of the big two remaining RTS game producers (assuming Blizzard will make WC4).
The 'community' wants an real time tabletop simulator because they can't afford to play tabletop (in terms of time, money, friends etc.). I'm from Nottingham, I remember getting that original Rogue Trader book in the 80s from Games Workshop when I was a kid on a day out shopping with my 20 pounds pocket money. Ahh the nostalgia, who'd have thought that such a thing would spawn an army of entitled whiny neckbeards 30 years later.
Iatros
He destroyed the Dow series and then left, what a ++heresy redacted++...
Dan388
I hope the project will live on.
B1ad3ua
Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment.
Brichals
The Nottingham thing is just a reference to that being where GW was (and still is) based. i think there were only lvery few GW stores in the UK back then. So I stumbled across 40K just because it was in a nerdy shop with cool pictures and books and models. So I've always been a bit proud of GW but to be honest I'm not so much anymore due to the type of people they attract.
I've not been a fan of Nottingham Forest since we had Brian Clough so you are right, they are an embarrassment.
0riginal_z0M
Humorous, however, I dont see how they made this game for DOW3 lovers, how could someone love DOW3 before the beta was released. IMO, This game was a clear indication that they had their fun with DOW2 and Philippe who just left, brought us back in the right direction...
As for his "Demeanor".. dude wtf lol
No hate for the guy hes done a good job, all we need now is to hope that someone as in Love with the game as we are steps up to bring us the other 6 races over the next 4 years ;]
LadderGoat
I'm guessing you never saw the smarmy interview with Leutin? Don't "dude wtf" me. It's a perfectly legitimate observation.
I'm sure DOW2 sold more units than DOW3 in this timescale.
Regarding it bringing DOW back in the right direction... You really think this is the right direction? DOW3 doesn't even look likely to have an expansion.
0riginal_z0M
Alright man well if he was so bad you need not worry because hes gone, and to be honest yeah, DOW2 sucked, I much prefer this, my ONLY problems are the balance with Eldar being unplayable at higher level.
I have a lot of hope that there will be a future for DOW3, I think you do too.. why else would you be here ?
Mr_Ruin
He acted like a know-it-all. He said that every single point made by the community is either wrong or non-existent. He acted towards Wh40k IP like it is made and loved by crazy people. ''Who cares what I do with it, there are yellow supermen in it and ppl still like it'' is a paraphrase of one of his interviews.
Therefore them letting him go is nothing unexpected and I say good riddance.
Brichals
That's a great attitude. His job is to design an RTS game. I keep saying this, Relic don't make your fantasy toys.
Lakaoum
Building a game with the community is possible. Risky if you are a big studio, but you could reach a success story : Best example : Endless Legends And Endless Space of Amplitude studio : games are just crafted hand to hand with community, and the result is awesome. Now, amplitude was bought by Sega, cause, this society becomes really interesting for any publishers. And sega lets (for instance) Amplitude act as before.
So Amplitude works with community, it brings a lot of benefits, and money ... enough to be predated by big publishers. SEGA is happy, they earn money on it.
So in fact, it is always the same : you can earn money if you work with passion, and a lot. And passion can be alone with your own idea, or with community. The most important is to not think about money first, but passion. If you do it correctly, then money will flow (even if you don't act for this at the beggining).
This story is the same for Blizzard, when they launch Warcraft1-2 and Starcraft. Passion, passion and passion.
Draconix
Hmmm.......makes sense. But unfortunately everything can change as time passes. Same with Blizzard, even they becamed too greedy, especially in case of Hots which I played for 2 years.
Passion is effective, but it can't always replace human's greed, which is a part of their nature, sadly.
Mr_Ruin
I don't even own a single model. It is not about ''fantasy toys'' it is about disrespecting the IP you are using. Same as if you gave a gun to Batman in a video game or added rocket launchers to F1 cause who cares, it's a game. You can do it, but someone will notice.
If you cannot at least respect the IP, then make a game without it with your own units and names etc. As Blizzard did. But Relic took the middle road, ''who cares about the IP but we still need it cause making new units is hard and expensive''.
Raindrop
If we compare him to Relics other game director, I prefered Quinn Duffys approach to Coh2, making the game more similar to the first one.
Philippe Boulle decided or allowed to remove too many things that I liked about DoW like alot of weapon upgrades on sqauds, sqaud leaders, armor and weapon types.
Dawn of war 3 feels to me like a child off Starcraft (army designs, two armor types, ect.) and LoL (grass cover, victory condition, art style) with the only thing being similar to Dawn of war being the squads.