@Amoc said:
I still think (and hope) that the long-term plan is to start working on a new version of the game. I think Relic realized back in October or early Nov that this version of DOW wasn't what folks were looking for. I'd guess that the numbers aren't there for them to be investing heavily in further supporting it.
I'd way rather see a reworked "expansion" or DoW IV under a very different design scheme.
Someone mentioned the first expansion could be named DoW III: Redemption
Maybe it would be better to name it dowIV even if its an expantion. Anything new should not be associated to this heresy; the chances of succes would be better imo.
Thats hilarious that you think people will be more likely to buy the game just if they crayoned out the 3 and put a 4 next to scribbled out 3. It will still have the same graphics and engine etc etc. So why not just improve DoW 3 and relaunch with more mechanics and content.
It could provide some symbolic validation for some of the "fanbase" that feels betrayed
Relic betrayed nobody imo. I kind of feel like its the other way around. But this would just end up derailing the topic.
Im a fan of everything 40k and fantasy but not once did i start flame wars on DoW 2 forums because i thought it was crap.
@Amoc said:
I still think (and hope) that the long-term plan is to start working on a new version of the game. I think Relic realized back in October or early Nov that this version of DOW wasn't what folks were looking for. I'd guess that the numbers aren't there for them to be investing heavily in further supporting it.
I'd way rather see a reworked "expansion" or DoW IV under a very different design scheme.
Someone mentioned the first expansion could be named DoW III: Redemption
Maybe it would be better to name it dowIV even if its an expantion. Anything new should not be associated to this heresy; the chances of succes would be better imo.
Thats hilarious that you think people will be more likely to buy the game just if they crayoned out the 3 and put a 4 next to scribbled out 3. It will still have the same graphics and engine etc etc. So why not just improve DoW 3 and relaunch with more mechanics and content.
It could provide some symbolic validation for some of the "fanbase" that feels betrayed
Relic betrayed nobody imo. I kind of feel like its the other way around. But this would just end up derailing the topic.
Im a fan of everything 40k and fantasy but not once did i start flame wars on DoW 2 forums because i thought it was crap.
Just to be clear, I'm not suggesting anyone was actually betrayed. It was more of a hypothetical answer to the usefulness of replacing the digit "3" with "4"
@Amoc said:
I still think (and hope) that the long-term plan is to start working on a new version of the game. I think Relic realized back in October or early Nov that this version of DOW wasn't what folks were looking for. I'd guess that the numbers aren't there for them to be investing heavily in further supporting it.
I'd way rather see a reworked "expansion" or DoW IV under a very different design scheme.
Someone mentioned the first expansion could be named DoW III: Redemption
Maybe it would be better to name it dowIV even if its an expantion. Anything new should not be associated to this heresy; the chances of succes would be better imo.
Thats hilarious that you think people will be more likely to buy the game just if they crayoned out the 3 and put a 4 next to scribbled out 3. It will still have the same graphics and engine etc etc. So why not just improve DoW 3 and relaunch with more mechanics and content.
Because it's an awful game. It cant gather no more than average 500 players no matter what they do. It should not have same engine and gameplay. If it has that same ++heresy redacted++ it will fail again.
Just look at coh2 playerbase right now.
You do realize relic LITERALLY GAVE OUT COH2 FOR FREE just now?
@Amoc said:
I still think (and hope) that the long-term plan is to start working on a new version of the game. I think Relic realized back in October or early Nov that this version of DOW wasn't what folks were looking for. I'd guess that the numbers aren't there for them to be investing heavily in further supporting it.
I'd way rather see a reworked "expansion" or DoW IV under a very different design scheme.
Someone mentioned the first expansion could be named DoW III: Redemption
Maybe it would be better to name it dowIV even if its an expantion. Anything new should not be associated to this heresy; the chances of succes would be better imo.
No, that would do more harm then good.
The possibility of people saying " Lelic now going money grab with new game instead of fixing old" is too high.
It would certainly have more PR-effect, if it showed DoW III getting "fixed".
Remember, an heretic can be redeemed an traitor not
Now that I think about it, you're absolutely right. All of the same MOBA trolls will be out again screeching some combination of "scam", "money grab", and "Relic betraaaaayed us". I was on the fence before but now I'm not. Relic has to change people's minds about DOW3, not reboot it as a sequel.
I may be repeating myself but I think Relic should move away from vanilla DOW3 as the core product. Make a DOW3 "expansion" that includes the 3 races we have now or make them purchasable DLC for the expansion. Definitely include space marines in the expansion. That will send a strong signal to new customers that vanilla DOW3 is dead, this new product is what you should be buying. It's more confusing than calling it DOW4 but it's more honest and it shows that Relic is committed to its games.
Interesting points, both of you @Nassir_Amit and @TokyoDream . Let me also to add something to it:
I remember when Ashes of Singularity of Singularity gotted a expansion, and you what I discovered? That originally the Vanilla and Escalation were supposed to be sold as separate products for respective kinds of players, with Vanilla being for Casuals and with Escalation being for Veterans, with both versions being supported. However Stardock eventually decided to merge Vanilla with Escalation after realising that previous plan has splitted the playercount making Escalation now a single product having also Vanilla content in it.
As for Dow3, I don't know how Relic would make that, but important for me, that there was a expansion. But its up to them and especially Sega to release a expansion.
@Amoc said:
I still think (and hope) that the long-term plan is to start working on a new version of the game. I think Relic realized back in October or early Nov that this version of DOW wasn't what folks were looking for. I'd guess that the numbers aren't there for them to be investing heavily in further supporting it.
I'd way rather see a reworked "expansion" or DoW IV under a very different design scheme.
Someone mentioned the first expansion could be named DoW III: Redemption
Maybe it would be better to name it dowIV even if its an expantion. Anything new should not be associated to this heresy; the chances of succes would be better imo.
I don't think it's a good idea. What makes you believe people will be buying DOW IV at all, especially if they abandon III? I sure as hell won't be buying DOW IV, ever. I won't even be buying any DLC for III at this point, unless they truly manage to turn things around, but to be realist, how big are chances of that?... To apply some common sense to all this mess, if I were dev, I'd just ditch DOW III and focus all effort on AOE IV not to be another flop, but even in this case, it's almost impossible task. I can just wish them luck.
Because it's an awful game. It cant gather no more than average 500 players no matter what they do. It should not have same engine and gameplay. If it has that same ++heresy redacted++ it will fail again.
@Amoc said:
I still think (and hope) that the long-term plan is to start working on a new version of the game. I think Relic realized back in October or early Nov that this version of DOW wasn't what folks were looking for. I'd guess that the numbers aren't there for them to be investing heavily in further supporting it.
I'd way rather see a reworked "expansion" or DoW IV under a very different design scheme.
Someone mentioned the first expansion could be named DoW III: Redemption
Maybe it would be better to name it dowIV even if its an expantion. Anything new should not be associated to this heresy; the chances of succes would be better imo.
Thats hilarious that you think people will be more likely to buy the game just if they crayoned out the 3 and put a 4 next to scribbled out 3. It will still have the same graphics and engine etc etc. So why not just improve DoW 3 and relaunch with more mechanics and content.
Because it's an awful game. It cant gather no more than average 500 players no matter what they do. It should not have same engine and gameplay. If it has that same ++heresy redacted++ it will fail again.
Just look at coh2 playerbase right now.
You do realize relic LITERALLY GAVE OUT COH2 FOR FREE just now?
So what ? Dow 3 was in 5 $ bundle and it couldn't gather any new players.
It gained a substantial amount of active population. This is not the same as "new" players, but this is something else that you're not describing correctly. The game "gains" new players all the time. Other players stop playing. So even if the population remains static, the game is still gaining new players. It's not the precise same 500 people every month forever, right?
All the while, the game is gaining owners as well, which is the important metric here. More permanent owners means more people for interest in future content. That's why publishers care so much about sales, more than the price of the game itself. Transition to games as service model.
Doing the thing where we compare it to a game where the comparison is favourable to whichever conclusion you've already drawn is disingenuous. People do it a lot, I know. A general point, more than a personal point. Furthermore, it means you don't understand the relationships between the two games. That is more of a personal point, though not meant personally. To explore that would be a tangent, so let's just say CoH as a franchise has always been more popular. CoH was more popular than both vDoW and DoW II.
Saying "DoW III struggles with player retention" is not the same as "DoW III was in a bundle and failed to get any new players". It's a new argument. Your old one came up against a counterargument, and to this end you have changed what it is we're debating about. I have no interest in that, sorry.
I am a 40k fan for nearly 30years, i have been playing 40k games since the chaos gate and space hulk.
By the very first time i had a glimpse in this cartoony Moba of a game, i felt disappointed, betrayed even...
The game ended up being better and more balanced than i thought as far as plenty of 40k content, lack of grim darkness and cartoony feeling is concerned. But it's core problem is that it is boring!
The SP is the worst i be seen in a strategy game in the past decade, at least, the bubble for cover one of the worst ideas ever conceived, killing sync kills made the game lose its unique character, but in effectiveness the moba line gameplay is what makes this game so boring, the tower, the shield and the core is the bane of the gameplay.
Relic tried to copy elements from SC2 and LoL and it backfired. The game is so damaged in it's core, that cannot be fixed with this game engine.
We have to understand that the game engine is where the significant investment is made in a game.
So this is the real reason we can't have a DOW 4, with a different game engine, it's much cheaper for Relic to make dlc and expansions for DOW3, than making a new game engine.
At this point i believe that even dlc for DOW2 would work better.
But there is one more option, maybe they can use the Age of Empires game engine as a core for a DOW4
the bubble for cover one of the worst ideas ever conceived
I think people give the bubble cover a hard time because of the way it looks. It's a huge improvement over DOW1 which had completely ineffective cover. I've gotten into some interesting tactical situations with those bubbles.
the bubble for cover one of the worst ideas ever conceived
I think people give the bubble cover a hard time because of the way it looks. It's a huge improvement over DOW1 which had completely ineffective cover. I've gotten into some interesting tactical situations with those bubbles.
but it is an tactical downgrade from what they (relic) are known to usually handle. No dynamic cover, no buildings.
And it is an visual downgrade from the craters aswell as permanently destroyable
Quite the opposite. Dynamic cover was well unreliable and overrated at best. And garrison cover is as useless and horrible as it was when DoW 2 first launched. I can get you missing your dynamic cover. But i absolutly dont understand why you got the hots for garrison cover. I never used it. All the people i played with or against never used it unless that once in a blue moon scenario popped up and you was fighting nids and wanted to troll them with your ranged commander.
Bubble cover on the other hand despite how ugly it looks. Is 100% functional. DoW 2 cover mechanics cant say the same.
the bubble for cover one of the worst ideas ever conceived
I think people give the bubble cover a hard time because of the way it looks. It's a huge improvement over DOW1 which had completely ineffective cover. I've gotten into some interesting tactical situations with those bubbles.
but it is an tactical downgrade from what they (relic) are known to usually handle. No dynamic cover, no buildings.
And it is an visual downgrade from the craters aswell as permanently destroyable
Quite the opposite. Dynamic cover was well unreliable and overrated at best. And garrison cover is as useless and horrible as it was when DoW 2 first launched. I can get you missing your dynamic cover. But i absolutly dont understand why you got the hots for garrison cover. I never used it. All the people i played with or against never used it unless that once in a blue moon scenario popped up and you was fighting nids and wanted to troll them with your ranged commander.
Bubble cover on the other hand despite how ugly it looks. Is 100% functional. DoW 2 cover mechanics cant say the same.
I agree, the building cover was far worse handled in DoW2 then in CoH.
I like it as giving me the feel to actually fight not only on an staged battlefield.
Well i dont see dirrctional cover coming back. But! They may implement medium cover that function similiarly to concealment cover fields but without impeding fog of war. Thats how i would add it,and it be something really easy to do.
the bubble for cover one of the worst ideas ever conceived
I think people give the bubble cover a hard time because of the way it looks. It's a huge improvement over DOW1 which had completely ineffective cover. I've gotten into some interesting tactical situations with those bubbles.
but it is an tactical downgrade from what they (relic) are known to usually handle. No dynamic cover, no buildings.
And it is an visual downgrade from the craters aswell as permanently destroyable
Because its unusable for the gameplay of DoW3.
You can't glue wings to a submarine and call it a plane.
@Gorb said:
Doing the thing where we compare it to a game where the comparison is favourable to whichever conclusion you've already drawn is disingenuous. People do it a lot, I know. A general point, more than a personal point. Furthermore, it means you don't understand the relationships between the two games. That is more of a personal point, though not meant personally. To explore that would be a tangent, so let's just say CoH as a franchise has always been more popular. CoH was more popular than both vDoW and DoW II.
Saying "DoW III struggles with player retention" is not the same as "DoW III was in a bundle and failed to get any new players". It's a new argument. Your old one came up against a counterargument, and to this end you have changed what it is we're debating about. I have no interest in that, sorry.
Because coh2 got from 4k players on average to 9k players on average and dow3 got no significant increase of players on average. That means that maybe load of players who got coh2 are actualy playing it often while those who got dow3 aren't. It's not old and new argument because your "old" argument and "new" are related. Its nothing about counterargument.
I dont think that coh was more popular than dow1. Just look the history , dow 1 was on wcg two consecutive years and I dont think we will ever have again a rts piece of art like dow1.
You can say "you don't think" that CoH was not more popular, but by the active numbers it was. It's hard to say with Steam of course, as vDoW predates it (and vDoW II had GfWL for a lot of the backend systems), but so does CoH in that vein. Currently vCoH has ~1,600 active players on Steam. That's the new Steam platform version (the legacy version has around 200 players by Steamcharts).
That's undeniably more active than any iteration of Dawn of War, for a game originally released in 2006. That doesn't mean CoH is necessarily a "better" game, of course, we're comparing it to vDoW and DoW II here (as well as DoW III). But CoH is simply a more popular product. The WWII setting has a greater appeal, would be my best guess.
DoW III got "significantly" more players, by active population. That's what I was trying to explain. Sure, it didn't reach 9k, but it didn't start from 4k. Your claim was that DoW III didn't gain any players. Do you see how that was wrong?
@Gorb said:
To explore that would be a tangent, so let's just say CoH as a franchise has always been more popular. CoH was more popular than both vDoW and DoW II.
@Gorb said:
DoW III got "significantly" more players, by active population. That's what I was trying to explain. Sure, it didn't reach 9k, but it didn't start from 4k. Your claim was that DoW III didn't gain any players. Do you see how that was wrong?
I don't, because I'm a human being and account for context when interpreting another human being's meaning. If I was a robot, or a if I was trying to be irritating, I could make a worthless argument focusing on the literal meaning of every statement, but I'm not. I therefore communicate like an honest human being.
Given that the game was available for dirt cheap and it's December (a popular month for gaming), it's no surprise that the # of players increased. Percentage-wise, it was a significant increase. Relatively speaking, as far as pure numbers go, it was actually pretty minimal. For a game this new, however, the numbers are still pathetic and they're not going to hold (just like they didn't hold in October).
@Amoc, once again you intervene to try and make some kind of veiled reference to my character and behaviour.
Things have to be taken literally online. There's no other contextual feedback that lets us interpret words. If people are allowed to make statements that are untrue, and not be held to them, we play an endless semantic game. The ones you repeatedly say you're not fond of. If we keep things as literal as possible - especially when making rather pointed claims about DoW III - then that reduces those semantic games.
I wasn't commenting on whether or not you or anyone found it surprising. I was challenging the narrative that it didn't gain any players. It's an important point, because it's important for newer (and interested, older players) to see the game receiving interest.
I have zero interest in playing move the goalposts, except to counter your tangent here.
Ah man, I dont think it really matters how you put it, this game is ++heresy redacted++ dead, shoulda been killed at birth. Every now and then I come back with the hopes of re-living my DOW 1 experience and nope... DOW3 = ranged uni spam and early elites in a 3v3 team on automatch is free win.
Sometimes youre lucky and you get a reasonably competitive game but the actions of the first 3 minutes pretty much determine a game.. The kind of game thats only fun when you win but even then you feel guilty that you spam & abuse.. I know they say if you cant beat them join but is it too much to ask for some simple barrance and new races? 9 race 8 player game mode maps to this shite??
What is it with these new gen developers and film directors that they just wana ++heresy redacted++ everything up with this weak ++heresy redacted++ nonsense.
@0riginal_z0M said:
Ah man, I dont think it really matters how you put it, this game is ++heresy redacted++ dead, shoulda been killed at birth. Every now and then I come back with the hopes of re-living my DOW 1 experience and nope... DOW3 = ranged uni spam and early elites in a 3v3 team on automatch is free win.
Sometimes youre lucky and you get a reasonably competitive game but the actions of the first 3 minutes pretty much determine a game.. The kind of game thats only fun when you win but even then you feel guilty that you spam & abuse.. I know they say if you cant beat them join but is it too much to ask for some simple barrance and new races? 9 race 8 player game mode maps to this shite??
What is it with these new gen developers and film directors that they just wana ++heresy redacted++ everything up with this weak ++heresy redacted++ nonsense.
I'm so sorry that you already lost faith in this game.
Still I will wait what's coming in February, but I don't expect new race thought. But would be nice if Relic would state otherwise.
@Gorb said: @Amoc, once again you intervene to try and make some kind of veiled reference to my character and behaviour.
Whatever do you mean Gorb?
@Gorb said:
Things have to be taken literally online. There's no other contextual feedback that lets us interpret words.
Language is contextual. Period. There's pretty much always contextual elements that help us interpret words. If that wasn't the case, then why are you whining about veiled references to your character and behavior? Once again your own arguments work against you.
@Gorb said:
If people are allowed to make statements that are untrue, and not be held to them, we play an endless semantic game.
As far as I can tell, that's all you really do here. You patrol the forums for posts criticizing the game, and then dissemble with worthless semantics.
@Gorb said:
I wasn't commenting on whether or not you or anyone found it surprising. I was challenging the narrative that it didn't gain any players. It's an important point, because it's important for newer (and interested, older players) to see the game receiving interest.
It's tiny amount of "interest" that required the stars to align with gutter-priced sales and the holiday season. The narrative you're peddling here is that this was a significant development. The narrative that I'll counter with is that wasn't, and that this interest will evaporate in January just like it did in October.
@0riginal_z0M said:
Ah man, I dont think it really matters how you put it, this game is ++heresy redacted++ dead, shoulda been killed at birth. Every now and then I come back with the hopes of re-living my DOW 1 experience and nope... DOW3 = ranged uni spam and early elites in a 3v3 team on automatch is free win.
Sometimes youre lucky and you get a reasonably competitive game but the actions of the first 3 minutes pretty much determine a game.. The kind of game thats only fun when you win but even then you feel guilty that you spam & abuse.. I know they say if you cant beat them join but is it too much to ask for some simple barrance and new races? 9 race 8 player game mode maps to this shite??
Some of these issues you are having are valid. But like any game they improve or change over time. No game starts out perfect.
What is it with these new gen developers and film directors that they just wana ++heresy redacted++ everything up with this weak ++heresy redacted++ nonsense.
I dont think relic is purposly is screwing up their game.
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Comments
CANNED_F3TUS
Relic betrayed nobody imo. I kind of feel like its the other way around. But this would just end up derailing the topic.
Im a fan of everything 40k and fantasy but not once did i start flame wars on DoW 2 forums because i thought it was crap.
charlando
Just to be clear, I'm not suggesting anyone was actually betrayed. It was more of a hypothetical answer to the usefulness of replacing the digit "3" with "4"
Katitof
You do realize relic LITERALLY GAVE OUT COH2 FOR FREE just now?
TokyoDream
Now that I think about it, you're absolutely right. All of the same MOBA trolls will be out again screeching some combination of "scam", "money grab", and "Relic betraaaaayed us". I was on the fence before but now I'm not. Relic has to change people's minds about DOW3, not reboot it as a sequel.
I may be repeating myself but I think Relic should move away from vanilla DOW3 as the core product. Make a DOW3 "expansion" that includes the 3 races we have now or make them purchasable DLC for the expansion. Definitely include space marines in the expansion. That will send a strong signal to new customers that vanilla DOW3 is dead, this new product is what you should be buying. It's more confusing than calling it DOW4 but it's more honest and it shows that Relic is committed to its games.
Draconix
Interesting points, both of you @Nassir_Amit and @TokyoDream . Let me also to add something to it:
I remember when Ashes of Singularity of Singularity gotted a expansion, and you what I discovered? That originally the Vanilla and Escalation were supposed to be sold as separate products for respective kinds of players, with Vanilla being for Casuals and with Escalation being for Veterans, with both versions being supported. However Stardock eventually decided to merge Vanilla with Escalation after realising that previous plan has splitted the playercount making Escalation now a single product having also Vanilla content in it.
As for Dow3, I don't know how Relic would make that, but important for me, that there was a expansion. But its up to them and especially Sega to release a expansion.
Opinion post.
Stoner
I don't think it's a good idea. What makes you believe people will be buying DOW IV at all, especially if they abandon III? I sure as hell won't be buying DOW IV, ever. I won't even be buying any DLC for III at this point, unless they truly manage to turn things around, but to be realist, how big are chances of that?... To apply some common sense to all this mess, if I were dev, I'd just ditch DOW III and focus all effort on AOE IV not to be another flop, but even in this case, it's almost impossible task. I can just wish them luck.
Endstille
Liar.
http://steamcharts.com/app/285190
518 > 500
By your logic all relic games are awful games, just look at SC2 playerbase right now.
http://www.rankedftw.com/stats/leagues/1v1/#v=2&r=-2&sx=a
What now?
Gorb
You're wrong on that, sorry.
http://steamcharts.com/app/285190
It gained a substantial amount of active population. This is not the same as "new" players, but this is something else that you're not describing correctly. The game "gains" new players all the time. Other players stop playing. So even if the population remains static, the game is still gaining new players. It's not the precise same 500 people every month forever, right?
All the while, the game is gaining owners as well, which is the important metric here. More permanent owners means more people for interest in future content. That's why publishers care so much about sales, more than the price of the game itself. Transition to games as service model.
Opinion post.
Gorb
Doing the thing where we compare it to a game where the comparison is favourable to whichever conclusion you've already drawn is disingenuous. People do it a lot, I know. A general point, more than a personal point. Furthermore, it means you don't understand the relationships between the two games. That is more of a personal point, though not meant personally. To explore that would be a tangent, so let's just say CoH as a franchise has always been more popular. CoH was more popular than both vDoW and DoW II.
Saying "DoW III struggles with player retention" is not the same as "DoW III was in a bundle and failed to get any new players". It's a new argument. Your old one came up against a counterargument, and to this end you have changed what it is we're debating about. I have no interest in that, sorry.
Iatros
I am a 40k fan for nearly 30years, i have been playing 40k games since the chaos gate and space hulk.
By the very first time i had a glimpse in this cartoony Moba of a game, i felt disappointed, betrayed even...
The game ended up being better and more balanced than i thought as far as plenty of 40k content, lack of grim darkness and cartoony feeling is concerned. But it's core problem is that it is boring!
The SP is the worst i be seen in a strategy game in the past decade, at least, the bubble for cover one of the worst ideas ever conceived, killing sync kills made the game lose its unique character, but in effectiveness the moba line gameplay is what makes this game so boring, the tower, the shield and the core is the bane of the gameplay.
Relic tried to copy elements from SC2 and LoL and it backfired. The game is so damaged in it's core, that cannot be fixed with this game engine.
We have to understand that the game engine is where the significant investment is made in a game.
So this is the real reason we can't have a DOW 4, with a different game engine, it's much cheaper for Relic to make dlc and expansions for DOW3, than making a new game engine.
At this point i believe that even dlc for DOW2 would work better.
But there is one more option, maybe they can use the Age of Empires game engine as a core for a DOW4
TokyoDream
@Iatros said:
I think people give the bubble cover a hard time because of the way it looks. It's a huge improvement over DOW1 which had completely ineffective cover. I've gotten into some interesting tactical situations with those bubbles.
CANNED_F3TUS
Quite the opposite. Dynamic cover was well unreliable and overrated at best. And garrison cover is as useless and horrible as it was when DoW 2 first launched. I can get you missing your dynamic cover. But i absolutly dont understand why you got the hots for garrison cover. I never used it. All the people i played with or against never used it unless that once in a blue moon scenario popped up and you was fighting nids and wanted to troll them with your ranged commander.
Bubble cover on the other hand despite how ugly it looks. Is 100% functional. DoW 2 cover mechanics cant say the same.
CANNED_F3TUS
Well i dont see dirrctional cover coming back. But! They may implement medium cover that function similiarly to concealment cover fields but without impeding fog of war. Thats how i would add it,and it be something really easy to do.
Katitof
Because its unusable for the gameplay of DoW3.
You can't glue wings to a submarine and call it a plane.
Gorb
You can say "you don't think" that CoH was not more popular, but by the active numbers it was. It's hard to say with Steam of course, as vDoW predates it (and vDoW II had GfWL for a lot of the backend systems), but so does CoH in that vein. Currently vCoH has ~1,600 active players on Steam. That's the new Steam platform version (the legacy version has around 200 players by Steamcharts).
http://steamcharts.com/app/228200
That's undeniably more active than any iteration of Dawn of War, for a game originally released in 2006. That doesn't mean CoH is necessarily a "better" game, of course, we're comparing it to vDoW and DoW II here (as well as DoW III). But CoH is simply a more popular product. The WWII setting has a greater appeal, would be my best guess.
DoW III got "significantly" more players, by active population. That's what I was trying to explain. Sure, it didn't reach 9k, but it didn't start from 4k. Your claim was that DoW III didn't gain any players. Do you see how that was wrong?
charlando
Sorry I couldn't resist
http://steamcharts.com/cmp/228200,9450,4580#3m
COH1 vs DOW1 , both games many years old. COH still far more popular than DOW. The comparison gets more extreme if we compare dow2 to coh2.
Amoc
I don't, because I'm a human being and account for context when interpreting another human being's meaning. If I was a robot, or a if I was trying to be irritating, I could make a worthless argument focusing on the literal meaning of every statement, but I'm not. I therefore communicate like an honest human being.
Given that the game was available for dirt cheap and it's December (a popular month for gaming), it's no surprise that the # of players increased. Percentage-wise, it was a significant increase. Relatively speaking, as far as pure numbers go, it was actually pretty minimal. For a game this new, however, the numbers are still pathetic and they're not going to hold (just like they didn't hold in October).
Gorb
@Amoc, once again you intervene to try and make some kind of veiled reference to my character and behaviour.
Things have to be taken literally online. There's no other contextual feedback that lets us interpret words. If people are allowed to make statements that are untrue, and not be held to them, we play an endless semantic game. The ones you repeatedly say you're not fond of. If we keep things as literal as possible - especially when making rather pointed claims about DoW III - then that reduces those semantic games.
I wasn't commenting on whether or not you or anyone found it surprising. I was challenging the narrative that it didn't gain any players. It's an important point, because it's important for newer (and interested, older players) to see the game receiving interest.
I have zero interest in playing move the goalposts, except to counter your tangent here.
0riginal_z0M
Ah man, I dont think it really matters how you put it, this game is ++heresy redacted++ dead, shoulda been killed at birth. Every now and then I come back with the hopes of re-living my DOW 1 experience and nope... DOW3 = ranged uni spam and early elites in a 3v3 team on automatch is free win.
Sometimes youre lucky and you get a reasonably competitive game but the actions of the first 3 minutes pretty much determine a game.. The kind of game thats only fun when you win but even then you feel guilty that you spam & abuse.. I know they say if you cant beat them join but is it too much to ask for some simple barrance and new races? 9 race 8 player game mode maps to this shite??
What is it with these new gen developers and film directors that they just wana ++heresy redacted++ everything up with this weak ++heresy redacted++ nonsense.
Draconix
I'm so sorry that you already lost faith in this game.
Still I will wait what's coming in February, but I don't expect new race thought. But would be nice if Relic would state otherwise.
Amoc
Whatever do you mean Gorb?
Language is contextual. Period. There's pretty much always contextual elements that help us interpret words. If that wasn't the case, then why are you whining about veiled references to your character and behavior? Once again your own arguments work against you.
As far as I can tell, that's all you really do here. You patrol the forums for posts criticizing the game, and then dissemble with worthless semantics.
It's tiny amount of "interest" that required the stars to align with gutter-priced sales and the holiday season. The narrative you're peddling here is that this was a significant development. The narrative that I'll counter with is that wasn't, and that this interest will evaporate in January just like it did in October.
CANNED_F3TUS
Some of these issues you are having are valid. But like any game they improve or change over time. No game starts out perfect.
I dont think relic is purposly is screwing up their game.